Labour law confusion causes loss of benefits Unclear labour laws have led to uncertainty among company managers and consequently to the loss of bonuses for workers, an official reported on Tuesday. The Head of the Labour Protection Division of the Lao Federation of Trade Union, Mr Samanxay Khanthanouxay, said that understanding of the amended labour law, brought into effect earlier this year, was still low among officials. He explained that in the past, employers had to pay the supporting fund to their workers when they left the job at the close of the employment agreement, regardless of how many years the employee had been with the company. The amended labour law does not mention whether companies are legally obliged to pay this fund. “Some officials misunderstand, thinking that when a contract is finished, the companies no longer have to pay the supporting fund, meaning the labourers lose their bonus,” said Mr Samanxay. To address this issue, a decree is being drafted to clarify the law. Mr Samanxay also urged employers to adhere to the Prime Minister's decree on the minimum wage for unskilled workers, which is set at 290,000 kip per month excluding overtime and bonuses for punctual and hard-working employees. In reality some companies pay workers as little as 80,000 to 100,000 kip per month. “Many employers count overtime and bonuses within the 290,000 kip per month, but that's wrong,” Mr Samanxay said. “We can only advise union members at provincial and district levels to encourage company managers to follow the Prime Minister's decree on the minimum wage for workers, and distribute the decree document to employers so that they will understand it,” he added. He said that the union had the right to negotiate and provide legal consultation when these cases are reported, but does not have the power to take punitive measures against employers, as this falls under the jurisdiction of the Ministry of Labour and Social Welfare. Mr Samanxay commented that the ongoing occurrence of this problem could be due to labour inspections being irregular and not thorough enough. He said that if officials do not check regularly to ensure that businesses operate within the labour laws, employers will work to their own requirements. A highlighted case showed that some companies operated in accordance with labour laws issued in 1991. These set leaving bonuses of three months' salary, but the current law requires employers to pay 10 percent of the per annum wage for those working three years or less and 15 percent for those working more than three years. Meanwhile, employees who have worked for less than three years but are made redundant must be paid 15 percent, and those working more than three years must receive 20 percent. By Souksakhone Vaenkeo (Latest Update August 24, 2007)
For reference : (1$=10000 Kip), ( For humble eating for one person at least: 25000 kip/day)
I believe to pay just 80 000k per month for unskill labour worker is terrible. LAO government must act, or must have law to change this unfair practice from any firm, company, small business people. The salary or wage of an unskill worker must be around 300 000k to 500 000k for each month.
We do not talk about SLAVERY now but UNJUST practice. Because in the past Slaves worked but had no wage or salary as we know, most of the time they were locked up at night, that the meanning of being a slave.
workers, for sure, but definitly poor and unlucky workers
A slave belong to his "boss". A slave is forced to work without limits, doesn't have any liberty, is avalaible for his boss 24h/24 7days/7, doesn't get any pay.... just some food. the boss have the right to do whatever he want with the slave: injure, sex, kill...
but work for less than 10$ per month.... wow.... who can accept that? First, a boss/investor HAVE TO RESPECT THE LAW. if the law say that there is minimum salary, it's unaccetable that a boss don't respect this.... a boss like this should go to jail for a few days, and all his money/goods should be taken to pay what he should and didn't pay.
Moreover, a boss have to respect his employees: of course, the boss take risk, invest his money, so if the business is good it's normal for him to get lot of money. If business is not so good (few income, few profit), i can understand the boss pay only the minimum salary for his employees... if he can find someone who accept to work for so few money, of course. But if the business is good, with good profits, it should also benefits to employees, and i think the boss should make an effort to give a decent pay to his employees... as long as the company can still make acceptable profits of course (because if he pay too much, no more profit... and he just have to stop business, and everyone loose his job). A good solution could be to say that a fixed % of the income or profit will be distributed (shared) to the employees (some kind of bonus). I would certainly do this if one day i invest in laos... it's fair and the good point is that this give to employees a good reason to work as well as they can to maximise their revenue (by maximising the revenue of the company)
The best way to find out how much a single person needs for the very basic things in life, and someone is married with dependent ( children ) is Lao authority should do a research, let go down the market and ask a worker to buy vegetables and meat or fish for each day of course depend on how many people he/she has to buy enough food for oneself or the whole family, and keeps a record, how much is the cost for each day, then lao authority will know how much a worker must spend for shopping for living in 1 month....in that way Lao goverment will have an idea about the range of wage or salary which a single worker is must be paid by company or firms....etc. That will provide some accuracy in calculating wage or salary for people.
In that way Lao government is sure that it still controls the country otherwise, there will be unlawful, unjust, unfair practice by those terrible companies, firms or business people who invest in Lao. A kind of they can do anything they like that sort of thing. This is 21 century we should let that thing happen.
hum... it's not so simple: the calculation of the "good" minimum salary is very complex
what do you count? just food? also house? education? healthcare?....
you know, in France, we have a high minimum salary (compared with many other countries): about 900 euros/months (10800000 kip).
One the first hand, even it's high, we could say it's not enough (in fact, pay is never enough): a family in France cannot live with 900 euros/month because food become more and more exensive, prices for house/apartments became absoloutly crazy those last year....
But on the other hand, 900euros/months+lot of tax for an employer is a lot... so the result is that many employers would like to employ more people to extend their business (get more profit, but also make more people living thanks to their business, make more income for the country... contributue to economic growth), but they cannot, because if they pay 900 euros/month +taxes for one more person, they will loose money.... that's too expensive regarding to the new benefit they can expect... so they don't employ more people,and we have more and more unemployment and really poor people in the country. It's very hard to find a job in France, espaciealy for unskilled people.
So what is the good solution? i don't know, but i just see it's not so simple to find the "best" minimum salary for a country. Anyway, i repeat: as long as a minimum salary have been defined by government, the employers HAVE to respect it.
Of course in France is another system, Like Australia France has Social Security but not in Lao yet, even that each time, again this is in Australia, each time the country has problems such as Inflation, rising of banks interest.....the australian media always does that, they take a troley and down to the super markets and find how much they spend for living in 1 week. To figure out the salary of people australian government has guideline a chata to layout the amount of money a worker will get, example a labour worker or process worker(factory worker) will get let say 300 australian dollar after tax....
But see whether the current salary is allright, or goes with the cost of living they always do this sort survey in Australia, Lao is not anywhere like France and Australia but it still one of the best to see whether a worker will survive with the layout salary....let say 80 000k/month here. I think it's ridiculous. My niece gets 500 000k for each month and she seems to be okay, the money for food plus other expenses such toilettries, clothes....etc.
Even Japan does not have social security benefit like France or Australia, in Asia only Taiwan did have the doll for unemployed people. If you are a japanese not very lucky, has no job, no money is likely you end up living in the streets, your house maybe a big box for the night as BBC report about Japan's social security matter. In Australia a family, let say the couple after spent all the amount of income they have for one week, and did not enough to support their family, then they had to go to Vincent de Paul is a Charity Organisation which provided supplement food cans and bread and other basic stuffs in life. In Lao the country is not rich, so the people when in trouble they go to neighbours for borrowing, basic things such rice and perhaps some amount of money to manage the days so they do not go hungry, or down to the river for fishing for extra protein.
I'm always suprised to see lao people can live with so low salary. Yes, prices are much lower compared with my country, but salaries seems to be much lower again.
But in laos, you see very few people who cannot eat or have to live in the streets : people help a lot each other, and houses are big (even if often, many people live in one house)
Do you know that, now, in France, some people who have a job (with minimum salary) have to live in the streets, because they cannot rent even a small apartment? Personnaly, i pay 700 euros/month for a 35m2 apartment in the subburbs of Paris (good subburbs, but not luxury at all).... and to accept to rent me this apartment, the owner ask me to have a salary of 3x700=2100 euros/months (if i have less, he would not accept to rent it to me, because in France, it's very difficult for the owner to get back his apartment when the person who rent don't pay). How someone who get 900 euros/months (minimum salary in France) can do, and pay for everything else (food, transportation to go to work...)?
But anyway i agree: pay someone in Lao for full time job 80000 kips/months is absoloutly unaceptable.... but i'm also surpised that some lao people accept so bad job: I know lao people are poor, but do they really have no other possibility? 80000 kips is so few and ridiculous... sure they couldn't get more money if they do any small job by themself (sell some food or simple service in the streets...)? Sure they cannot have a better solution to "use" their time? Wow!
I believe minimum wage or salary of a single lao worker must be at least 500 000k per month, the person who is in charge about human resource of LAO, if he/she could not see this or have this vision....or beyond his/her ability to bring this sort of amount of money for his/her people then Lao leader, Priminister or President should find another person with qualification and knowledge in this field to do the job, simple as that....otherwise LAO will behind and hard to catch up with the World. Have guidelines for investors who come to invest in LAO.
Yes, sad to hear such a ignorance. As someone mentioned earlier in another topic, together with being glad and welcome foreign investors, Lao government need to help our people to play in the game fairly. Yes, it is very good that they come to invest their money in our country, but don't forget that the nature of investors or last time we loved to call "capitalists" is profit. The more profit the more they are happy. That's why we need a good law protecting our people as all civilized countried did and do. I don't think it would be very hard for our lawmakers to make such a good law, if not they don't want to learn from other civilized nations or they are really not capable to do.
Again the reason i said minimum wage or salary of lao worker must be 500 000k/month because this is the kind of money my niece gets for each month, and she told me, her salary only just enough for living, not much left for saving, so you see now how terrible a single worker only receives just 80 000k/month. This year I saw a document from BBC reported on the unfair of cheap labour, in China, sometime the First World or rich countries played a part in this so not civilised way.....from civilised countries, BBC went into the factory's accommodations which they built for chinese workers, most are girls who live and work in this factory( producing, shirts and jeans for western countries) The condition of the houses which chinese girls (workers) who live here is terrible,10 girls in just one little room, and no heater for winter, they have to go to bed with jacket so keep them warm, no central heating, means no hot water for you to wash your face in the morning during winter, and guess what the chinese workers got from each jean they made 70 cents and how much the big stores in western countries sell for each jean around 60 us dollar to more than 100 us dollar jeans like Levis.....that the ugly side of Capitalism that BBC brought it to us so we understand, that's why sometime civilised countries have practices which not civilised at all, according to BBC report, and make your own judgement after you see this. That's why LAO authority must employ qualified people for this job, so they know what they have to do or deal with ISSUES occured.
Having read above comments, mentioning that our government needs to change the authorities concerned from bad to good people. Then, I am thinking about why our government system is so ineffective. I don’t know whether our government leaders have ever thought why our Lao government system is not so effective compared to other countries’ systems. I presume that they even have thought about this issue much more than me. One may argue that why I do interfere with such an issue so long as it is not my business. Yes, I am an ordinary person. However, I would like to share my thought and I think that I also love Laos not less than other people, to say the least. I don’t mean that my opinion is perfect, but at least partly it could be true. We Lao people are really glad that during last time our government is welcome to listen to the people opinion or in other words “Sieng Nok Sieng Ka”, which means in our society there is democracy, although the question left is more or less, but there is. That is already fine. Everyone knows that nothing can be changed over night. However, the effectiveness is still far from good. So far, I have heard that our people, as well as our leaders, love to blame the quality of our education. That means the bad things are always thrown to Ministry of Education, although every year hundreds of students graduated from local and oversea universities. The improvement of our system effectiveness, however, hardly can be seen. Why? The reasons are many. Number one, the good people cannot enter to government system. The old low education people were there and still are there. There is no quota for the new one to enter. Number two, some said there is low competition or sometimes no competition at all, especially the special case. That’s why our government cannot get personnel who would be able to get job done. Yes, I really would like to agree with this saying. In a special case I feel like some were born to be bosses, but some were born to be servant. Number three, I also have heard that the way our authorities in some departments promote servants is also not so good, sometimes looks ugly. Those, who love to praise the boss or give things to the boss or to support the boss idea, it’s like the boss would never have made mistake, would definitely get promotion, regardless of whether they are, though. That means the out spoken people like me or you would never get promotion. As our Lao proverb saying: “Da Nay Pai Tong Nee”. If you want to criticize the boss, you need to make a plan to go out; otherwise if you still stay there, you will feel like you are in hell. You will never get promotion, although you are really good and work hard, that’s why it is not fair for the out spoken people stay there. Yes, it’s sadly to say that our government has lost a lot of good personnel due to this issue. Now when our government wants to get jobs done but less people can do, because of low education; because of the fact that government has only people who love to talk, love to praise their bosses or love to repeat what their bosses have said; they cannot think by themselves and to say nothing of innovation. Yes, really if we can change the above mentioned cultures in our society, probably things would get improved. However, I hope this kind of ineffectiveness may be changed soon. Not so long ago, our young and smart, also I would say out spoken, Prime Minister Bouasone Bouphavanh declared: “It’s time for action. We have no time to talk any more”. That means he does not like anymore the authorities who love just talking, but need to work hard to get jobs done. According to this saying, I understand like: “If you don’t know you should learn otherwise you should give ways for other people. You had talked for 32 years already.” Yes, all this is my opinion. And admittedly, it’s not so scientific, but partly it was a truth, I believe. I think, those problems what I have mentioned are main factors to make our government system not so effective. I would really appreciate if anyone has any suggestion. Why does our Lao government system so ineffective?
80 000k for each month a lao worker only afford to eat just 8 bowls of noodle, fur or kwai teow as we know, how ridiculous is it? What kind of firm or people who invested in LAO to pay a lao worker with this sort of wage. I believe it's time Lao's leaders must be serious about this issue, otherwise Lao priminister or president must show the door to the minister who in charge of this field, or tell him/her to go back to school. Otherwise it looks like LAO is an unlawful country, this is 21 century now.
it is sad to hear all those comments about lao labor, it weakness, low paid salaries... i know that rome was not built in one day but we have spent 32 years to built our country but in ineffective way, we have wold super quality wood but we could not manage to produce high quality furnitures for exporting , we exported timber instead...the wage settled by gvt was underpoverty income level that leaded automatically to corruption cos` people could not live with such a low living condition and became a custom, to tell the truth : chauffeurs steal fuel from their trucks to get some extra money . the construction worker steal the cement of the state company not mentioning the easy living condition of the leading personnels and exct...at the end the outcome of this behavior is the bankrupcy of many state companies so we went and go to the wrong way, if we do not change in the very near future we will fail to reach the standard of neighbouring countries. regards
I believe Lao government should kick them out of country for those firms or small business which invest in LAO. For lao business people who pratice this kind of unfair then put heavy fine on them....if they still continue to employ lao worker with ridiculous wage then close them down.
For Minister who in charge in this matter if he/she could not see the issue then he/she must go, let other who at least have some kind of qualification take responsibilities for this job, ( at least a degree in Account, or Economy, because in Accountin you must study some aspects of LAW).
as i know, it is the duty of lao trade union organization to protect worker`s right but i wonder whether its officials are doing their duty properly. as everyone knows that heads of most of firms are clever... they know how to oiling auditor personnels...like traders oiling tax officials...
THE COST OF LIVING IN LAOS IS VERY HIGH COMPARE TO THE DEVELOPED COUNTRIES. I AGREE, THE STANDARD MINIMUM WAGES SHOULD BE 500000 KIPS PER MONTH.AT LEAST THEY CAN SAVE UP FOR OTHER NEEDS LIKE MEDICAL, RENT, WATER, ELECTRICITY, EDUCATION, GAS, OR BUY A HOUSE, ETC.
